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Author Topic: Delage 15-S-8  (Read 53195 times)

Marek.Z.N

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  • Posts: 332
  • Building an electric Delage 15-S-8
  • Location: Bagshot, Surrey
Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #60 on: 05 Feb 20, 07:23 pm »
Quote
Ideally wherever bolts pass through tubes there should be crush tubes, especially where the wall thickness is as thin as "we" use. They don't have to be welded in place, one side hole just big enough to let the tube (or "top hat") in, and the tube butts against the inside wall on the other face. It allows for the proper clamping force to be applied. FWIW I get growled at by my son whenever I don't use them and a torque wrench on every bolt.

okay thanks Rhys. Will add some
« Last Edit: 18 Apr 20, 05:56 pm by StefanN »

Marek.Z.N

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  • Posts: 332
  • Building an electric Delage 15-S-8
  • Location: Bagshot, Surrey
Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #61 on: 05 Feb 20, 07:24 pm »
And the milk bottles were heated in an oven until they had gone soft and 'napalm like' then clamped in a square container and left overnight to cool.

TheGiantTribble

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  • Bill Alexander, Maserati 750 V8RI Red
  • Location: Clacton on Sea, Essex.
Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #62 on: 06 Feb 20, 09:32 am »
Thanks for the info re milk bottles.

Marek.Z.N

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  • Posts: 332
  • Building an electric Delage 15-S-8
  • Location: Bagshot, Surrey
Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #63 on: 15 Apr 20, 07:10 pm »
Today i was back at it and continued work on the formers. This plan shows half of the former i am working on (the dashboard) the metal is bent and welded to the angle iron at the bottom. now need to make the metal gussets around the inside and then edit the video. When i then make the other former only 15cm forward i will have a bulkhead which will be very similar in design (not shape) to the one found on a Bugatti type 35 or 37. happy to be back working on something

RhysN

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  • Location: Tamworth
Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #64 on: 15 Apr 20, 08:03 pm »
Hi Marek, nice drawings. Are you sure you need to be using such heavy material? I have never used 3 mm on full sized cars. There is a difference between over engineering, and over material. Can I suggest being a bit more clever with the design and less with the iron mongery. You have the chance here to be clever, triangulation, folding edges etc and save a lot of weight.The heaviest in my Lotus 11 was 1.6 with folded edges, mostly 1.2 mm. Yes I know Lotus were fragile.
The Morgan has nothing over 2 mm so far,  and 80 years old.
We must avoid torturing our brains with false problems, it occupies but it can annoy. In jest!

Marek.Z.N

  • Forum user
  • Posts: 332
  • Building an electric Delage 15-S-8
  • Location: Bagshot, Surrey
Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #65 on: 16 Apr 20, 11:35 am »
i will keep that in mind. the main reason for such thick material was it is all we have at the moment and we are ordering more metal (including lots of 20x2mm) that will be used for the gussets and the other formers

RhysN

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  • Location: Tamworth
Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #66 on: 16 Apr 20, 12:18 pm »
Fair enough. I guess I do try to keep that weight suggestion of maximum (Stevensons) of 250 lbs. Most of mine are more like 200 lbs. On the full size Peugeot I'm building the original scuttle angle was 20 by 1.2 angle, and lasted from 1923, so I replicated that. B & Q have some very good angle sections and others worth looking at.
I'm guessing that the Bugattis you were close to had pretty thin materials too. Lucky lad  to have been that close!
We must avoid torturing our brains with false problems, it occupies but it can annoy. In jest!

StefanN

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  • Location: Bagshot, Surrey, United Kingdom
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Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #67 on: 16 Apr 20, 01:10 pm »
Hi Marek, nice drawings. Are you sure you need to be using such heavy material? I have never used 3 mm on full sized cars. There is a difference between over engineering, and over material. Can I suggest being a bit more clever with the design and less with the iron mongery. You have the chance here to be clever, triangulation, folding edges etc and save a lot of weight.The heaviest in my Lotus 11 was 1.6 with folded edges, mostly 1.2 mm. Yes I know Lotus were fragile.
The Morgan has nothing over 2 mm so far,  and 80 years old.
Where do you get 2mm flat bar from?  Most places I've used go down to 3mm.

RhysN

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Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #68 on: 16 Apr 20, 03:53 pm »
I buy my thin materials from local steel suppliers as sheet then cut what I want with the angle grinder with 1 mm disc (as on my Morgan rebuild page).
I have also bought from B & Q under their builders metals. I was going to provide a link, but says a 59 minute queue right now. They have a variety of angles of various sizes, round and square tubes, flat bar mesh etc. I have just checked and I have a short section of 25 by 2mm flat bar, still with the B & Q bar code.
« Last Edit: 16 Apr 20, 03:56 pm by RhysN »
We must avoid torturing our brains with false problems, it occupies but it can annoy. In jest!

jim

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Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #69 on: 16 Apr 20, 06:16 pm »
I use FH Brundle for most of my steel, they have a varied selection of stock bar, flat ect. Also lots wrought iron bits to weld together and make garden ornaments that your wives won't actually allow you to put in the garden.  ;D

jim

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Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #70 on: 16 Apr 20, 06:27 pm »
I have also quite often when I only need small bits  gone to sheet metal fabricators and got offcuts for free.

RhysN

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Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #71 on: 17 Apr 20, 09:50 am »
Marek and Stefan, I do understand that right now you may be controlled more by what you have, and to an extent what is available on line in these weird times.
Please accept that I may be offering thoughts of what would be nice. You mention 20 by 2 mm, yet your drawing showed 3 mm, 2 is a whole lot better I believe. I do keep an eye on what has been put out at the side of the road for the [people] to get, sometimes there is stuff I can use! BBQs are being thrown out round here, lots of sheet metal.
Are you able to access any of the racing car design books? Costin and Phipps  "Racing and Sports Car chassis design" while now over 50 years old is still a base point for steel chassis design. There is a lot in there about bracket making, diaphragm frames and such.
Likewise I know that you now have time and want to make progress, if you can, just do a bit more research of lighter ways to do things, more complex but you will make a car you will be proud to show off as you will anyway.
As an example of where I'm coming from, have a look at the Austin chassis you have. It's lasted nearly 100 years. Then have a look at the approx 1950s steering wedge and think if, with the knowledge you now have, and equipment, could you do something less blacksmith. Again, no criticism of the bracket, it's what was done and actually promoted in books of the Austin special builders in the 1950s, can it now be done differently?
« Last Edit: 17 Apr 20, 12:46 pm by StefanN »
We must avoid torturing our brains with false problems, it occupies but it can annoy. In jest!

Marek.Z.N

  • Forum user
  • Posts: 332
  • Building an electric Delage 15-S-8
  • Location: Bagshot, Surrey
Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #72 on: 17 Apr 20, 12:25 pm »
When lockdown is over i will check out some sheet metal companies to see if they have any cutoffs. dad made an order yesterday for all sorts of strip metal so should have more to work with soon. if we need more will check out FH brundle. thanks for the advice Jim. If i want to reduce some weight from my cyclekart i can always drill some holes out in places that wont make it too weak.
« Last Edit: 17 Apr 20, 12:47 pm by StefanN »

RhysN

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Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #73 on: 17 Apr 20, 09:02 pm »
Slightly OT, I was once building a racing yacht (what is called a sailing dinghy in the UK) and spent an entire day cutting holes to lighten it. I saved a total of 1 pound! If I had planed down the same piece of timber from 25 mm to 20 I would have saved 3 pounds, at least as calculated. That was my lesson to try to make the material decisions early. Any how, this is your first CK Marek, I'm sure it won't be the last, so crack on and enjoy the build.
We must avoid torturing our brains with false problems, it occupies but it can annoy. In jest!

jim

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  • Location: northants
Re: Delage 15-S-8
« Reply #74 on: 17 Apr 20, 09:23 pm »
I love drilling holes in all my components Marek. It looks really cool. A good step drill will be your new best mate.  ;D